On Wednesday, 5 March 2003 Gordon Brown promised that the Government would spend "whatever it takes" to deprive Saddam Hussein of his weapons of mass destruction.
If Gordon Brown had not wasted so much of our money looking for weapons of mass destruction, the UK would not be in such a weak financial situation today
I recall a lively letter,published in press, from a Socialist Worker Party men.
He criticised a Thanet resident, for having sent money to support George Galloway, opposing the then proposed plan to invade Iraq whilst at the same time being vehemently opposed to the IRA.
The SWP letter, if I recall, called the British Army in Ulster an Army of occupation.
The money was sent to support Galloways right to freedom of expression in the Commons. No matter what his view is he must have freedom to express it.
The man's argument was that it could be extrapolated simply from the history of Thor in Thanet that Intelligence had a fuller picture about Iraq's weapon capability then they were letting on.
That man was spot on the money with his judgements then.
The Arab nations are swimming in oil, yet everytime there is a disaster in a poor Muslim counry, tax payers in western nations like the UK foot the bill.
I guess countries like Iran need their money to fight our soldiers by proxy; they are very clever, in the way that they use islamist-propagana to pull at our heart strings.
Combine this with the way that Iran finance Hamas behind the scenes, together with the help that our well meaning do-gooders unwittingly give to the world islamist movement, this can only end with liberal democracy being handed over to neo-islamists on a plate.
The British tax payer could be repaid by Iraq.
If it was not for our own well meaning do-gooders we could recieve payments in oil. Nothing wrong with that. Why should we pay, while they laugh at us. Even the Doctor that drove his can into a Scottish airport was a peace loving muslim, until he decided otherwise.
Its not the people that are dangerous, its people with their heads full of polico-religous dogma that can become dangerous at any moment.
In many ways. Neo-Nazisism was like a religion, but because it did not have the staus of a religion, it was easy to speak openly against the results of its dogma.
I would like to end, by saying that we must work together, with all true Muslims to stop extremism before it appears its ugly head.
The KENT COUNTY elections are this year; we need to know what Clive Hart and Chris Wells think about this governments current postion on IRAQ... If they continue to say nothing, I will consider standing as a "STOP THE WAR CANDIDATE"
Might be more interesting to find out what they think, and will do, about matters that affect Kent. They are not national politicians and their views on Iraq are irrelvenat to KCC elections.
Equally, while Councillor Gregory is perfectly entitled to pontificate on national political issues, why not, Councillor, use your blog to canvas views on local issues? You steadfastly fail to do this. As a TDC Councillor, you might want to find out what people think about the Tories' woeful mismanagement of Council business, and your failure to deliver a quality service to local people.
Looks like you and your blog have been overtaken by surrender monkeys Ken. I thought wars appealed to Tory's like you as a good business opportunity? Or could they be the salvation of UK Inc i.e. a few more could help GB get us out of his credit crunch cock up.
Suggestions to Ken for a soft target for starters.
Whether you and others, like it or not, Iraq will be the second biggest factor regarding the way many people vote in Thanet this year. Country Councillor's Clive Hart & Chris Wells might be local politians; however they are part of a power base network that helps our MPs stay in office.
I live in Cllr Clive Hart's ward and I wish to hear what local polticians think about Gordon Brown's currect policy on Iraq.
For example:
Cllr Clive Hart has a duty to speak up either against or in support of his government's policy on Iraq. I also look forward to hearing what Mr Well's thinks
The person that said local politician's views on Iraq are irrelevent, is living in a dream world, rather like a salesman that tells the customer what his objections for not buying should be.
IT IS A FACT, THAT LOCAL ELECTIONS ARE CONNECTED TO NATIONAL POLITICS ONE WAY OR ANOTHER. Even the wonderful Jerry O'Donnell can't get away from that.
THIS IS THE REAL WORLD - THE VOTERS SET THE PACE!
Although I'm no fan of the Tories, I believe that it is only fair to give Ken Gregory credit where cridit is due - this is the right subject Ken - nice that there is a councillor starting to listen at last.
Well it will be interesting to see how many local candidates - of whichever party - are prepared to let the Iraq War become an election issue in the County Council elections.
We might field some "STOP THE WAR MR BROWN" candidates.
I am told that Anti-China Gateway's Christine T wants to stand. I've been told that Cllr Chris Wells voted against the Gateway and Cllr Clive Hart never turned up for the vote - avoiding being seen supporting Steve Ladyman's pro Gateway stance.
Cllr. Clive Hart was at the full council meeting and had to leave due to ill-health. He was then treated for a serious condition so get your facts right, anon. 17.41. Cllr. Hayton who is a KCC councillor joined Cllr. Wells in voting against the China Gateway Project so perhaps you can ask him why he took that particular stance when he is on the stump for the county elections.
I think county councillors should worry about the county first and find out how to get back the £50m. invested in the Icelandic banking system on the advice of the Conservative Party chairman's company then let's worry about Iraq.
Well said, Anon 13.15 - there are more immediate issues for County Councillors properly to focus on. Anon 13.36, you are clearly not interested in fact, just your own fantasy version of events.
Councillor Clive Hart can't afford to loose his county seat, it appears that he needs the french benefits, and the best way to avoid a vote - is don't be there!
Strange that personal remarks about a political rival don't cut across this blog-meister's code of ethics. But then, so typical of the Tory philosophy that pervades, and is crippling, Thanet.
As someone who was at the council meeting from the beginning I can assure everyone that Clive was there from the start (he came in with his wife who sat behind me in the public gallery) until he was too unwell to continue and they both left. Clive subsequently spent a month receiving treatment.
Come on, Cllr. Gregory, these personal attacks on Cllr. Hart surely contravene your own blog code of what is acceptable or is it because he's a Labour councillor that you are allowing them to continue?
Your last comment hits the nail firmly on the head, Anon 08.30. Councillor Gregory has allowed a reference to "Labour scum" on his blog, on the basis that the same contributor also referred to the Tories - sympathetically! He has also deleted perfectly fair comments about his close political friend John Worrow.
That is the prevailing view of fairness here abouts.
Presumably all personal attacks will be removed from every blog sites? To Clarify. A personal comment on a councillor or any politician is 'OK' ? if it is not actionable, If I think it is actionable it will be removed.
If it were not the case how would Blunkett or the Hamiltons, or even Mandelson have been in the press.
Cllr Hart, who is both a District and County Councillor was at the China Gateway meeting, did leave before the vote, and was not a well man at the time.
I was there, as a District Councillor as well, and voted against the development because I did not believe it was a stand alone application, nor was there enough protection for the residents of Acol.
My daughter has just returned froma spell of duty in Iraq, and has friends there noiw whom I know well. History will have some fun judging the rights and wrongs of this matter, and probably decide it was an ill concieved venture, justified by half truth and lie, that achieved what could have been achieved after the invasion of Kuwait and saved many lives lost to the Saddam regime's brutality.
That said, there was no UN mandate to invade in either case, so the legelity of the war has always been dubious.
I wish politicians read a bit of history, however, including President Obama; because if they did they would think far more carefully about intentions in Afghanistan, as well as Iraq.
It remains vital that we all support the work of our armed forces in both places: I know only too well how important it is to those risking their lives. And how questions are asked during the return of body bags and assembling for funerals. Somehow we have to separate our concerns about political decision from our support for the people risking their lives on our behalf. That is a tough call, but an important one.
27 comments:
Gordon Brown insisted that Blair and Bush were right to invade Iraq.
He claimed Iraq has been left a better place by the US-UK led invasion.
George Bush called it a "noble" war and predicted it will end in victory - despite most Americans and Brits calling it a failure.
On Wednesday, 5 March 2003 Gordon Brown promised that the Government would spend "whatever it takes" to deprive Saddam Hussein of his weapons of mass destruction.
If Gordon Brown had not wasted so much of our money looking for weapons of mass destruction, the UK would not be in such a weak financial situation today
I recall a lively letter,published in press, from a Socialist Worker Party men.
He criticised a Thanet resident, for having sent money to support George Galloway, opposing the then proposed plan to invade Iraq whilst at the same time being vehemently opposed to the IRA.
The SWP letter, if I recall, called the British Army in Ulster an Army of occupation.
The money was sent to support Galloways right to freedom of expression in the Commons. No matter what his view is he must have freedom to express it.
The man's argument was that it could be extrapolated simply from the history of Thor in Thanet that Intelligence had a fuller picture about Iraq's weapon capability then they were letting on.
That man was spot on the money with his judgements then.
The Arab nations are swimming in oil, yet everytime there is a disaster in a poor Muslim counry, tax payers in western nations like the UK foot the bill.
I guess countries like Iran need their money to fight our soldiers by proxy; they are very clever, in the way that they use islamist-propagana to pull at our heart strings.
Combine this with the way that Iran finance Hamas behind the scenes, together with the help that our well meaning do-gooders unwittingly give to the world islamist movement, this can only end with liberal democracy being handed over to neo-islamists on a plate.
The British tax payer could be repaid by Iraq.
If it was not for our own well meaning do-gooders we could recieve payments in oil. Nothing wrong with that. Why should we pay, while they laugh at us. Even the Doctor that drove his can into a Scottish airport was a peace loving muslim, until he decided otherwise.
Its not the people that are dangerous, its people with their heads full of polico-religous dogma that can become dangerous at any moment.
In many ways. Neo-Nazisism was like a religion, but because it did not have the staus of a religion, it was easy to speak openly against the results of its dogma.
I would like to end, by saying that we must work together, with all true Muslims to stop extremism before it appears its ugly head.
THANET'S LABOUR councillors need to speak out against Brown's policy on IRAQ, - It looks like they all support Gordon stance!
The KENT COUNTY elections are this year; we need to know what Clive Hart and Chris Wells think about this governments current postion on IRAQ... If they continue to say nothing, I will consider standing as a "STOP THE WAR CANDIDATE"
DL
Might be more interesting to find out what they think, and will do, about matters that affect Kent. They are not national politicians and their views on Iraq are irrelvenat to KCC elections.
Equally, while Councillor Gregory is perfectly entitled to pontificate on national political issues, why not, Councillor, use your blog to canvas views on local issues? You steadfastly fail to do this. As a TDC Councillor, you might want to find out what people think about the Tories' woeful mismanagement of Council business, and your failure to deliver a quality service to local people.
Looks like you and your blog have been overtaken by surrender monkeys Ken. I thought wars appealed to Tory's like you as a good business opportunity? Or could they be the salvation of UK Inc i.e. a few more could help GB get us out of his credit crunch cock up.
Suggestions to Ken for a soft target for starters.
To Anonymous 18 January 2009 10:28
Whether you and others, like it or not, Iraq will be the second biggest factor regarding the way many people vote in Thanet this year. Country Councillor's Clive Hart & Chris Wells might be local politians; however they are part of a power base network that helps our MPs stay in office.
I live in Cllr Clive Hart's ward and I wish to hear what local polticians think about Gordon Brown's currect policy on Iraq.
For example:
Cllr Clive Hart has a duty to speak up either against or in support of his government's policy on Iraq. I also look forward to hearing what Mr Well's thinks
The person that said local politician's views on Iraq are irrelevent, is living in a dream world, rather like a salesman that tells the customer what his objections for not buying should be.
IT IS A FACT, THAT LOCAL ELECTIONS ARE CONNECTED TO NATIONAL POLITICS ONE WAY OR ANOTHER. Even the wonderful Jerry O'Donnell can't get away from that.
THIS IS THE REAL WORLD - THE VOTERS SET THE PACE!
Although I'm no fan of the Tories, I believe that it is only fair to give Ken Gregory credit where cridit is due - this is the right subject Ken - nice that there is a councillor starting to listen at last.
Well it will be interesting to see how many local candidates - of whichever party - are prepared to let the Iraq War become an election issue in the County Council elections.
We might field some "STOP THE WAR MR BROWN" candidates.
I am told that Anti-China Gateway's Christine T wants to stand. I've been told that Cllr Chris Wells voted against the Gateway and Cllr Clive Hart never turned up for the vote - avoiding being seen supporting Steve Ladyman's pro Gateway stance.
Cllr. Clive Hart was at the full council meeting and had to leave due to ill-health. He was then treated for a serious condition so get your facts right, anon. 17.41. Cllr. Hayton who is a KCC councillor joined Cllr. Wells in voting against the China Gateway Project so perhaps you can ask him why he took that particular stance when he is on the stump for the county elections.
I think county councillors should worry about the county first and find out how to get back the £50m. invested in the Icelandic banking system on the advice of the Conservative Party chairman's company then let's worry about Iraq.
Cllr Hart was not there from the start. Of course he was unwell, I really believe that one!
Well said, Anon 13.15 - there are more immediate issues for County Councillors properly to focus on. Anon 13.36, you are clearly not interested in fact, just your own fantasy version of events.
People are not daft. Cllr Hart looks very healthy!
He was seen!
Councillor Clive Hart can't afford to loose his county seat, it appears that he needs the french benefits, and the best way to avoid a vote - is don't be there!
Is french like fringe, but with a different taste?
It all worked out just as planned! Hiding behind the skirt of Iris works very well!
And his wife. Sooner or later she must get fed up with supporting him?
What a pale imitation of a man.
Strange that personal remarks about a political rival don't cut across this blog-meister's code of ethics. But then, so typical of the Tory philosophy that pervades, and is crippling, Thanet.
As someone who was at the council meeting from the beginning I can assure everyone that Clive was there from the start (he came in with his wife who sat behind me in the public gallery) until he was too unwell to continue and they both left. Clive subsequently spent a month receiving treatment.
Come on, Cllr. Gregory, these personal attacks on Cllr. Hart surely contravene your own blog code of what is acceptable or is it because he's a Labour councillor that you are allowing them to continue?
Your last comment hits the nail firmly on the head, Anon 08.30. Councillor Gregory has allowed a reference to "Labour scum" on his blog, on the basis that the same contributor also referred to the Tories - sympathetically! He has also deleted perfectly fair comments about his close political friend John Worrow.
That is the prevailing view of fairness here abouts.
Presumably all personal attacks will be removed from every blog sites?
To Clarify. A personal comment on a councillor or any politician is 'OK' ? if it is not actionable, If I think it is actionable it will be removed.
If it were not the case how would Blunkett or the Hamiltons, or even Mandelson have been in the press.
Cllr Hart, who is both a District and County Councillor was at the China Gateway meeting, did leave before the vote, and was not a well man at the time.
I was there, as a District Councillor as well, and voted against the development because I did not believe it was a stand alone application, nor was there enough protection for the residents of Acol.
My daughter has just returned froma spell of duty in Iraq, and has friends there noiw whom I know well. History will have some fun judging the rights and wrongs of this matter, and probably decide it was an ill concieved venture, justified by half truth and lie, that achieved what could have been achieved after the invasion of Kuwait and saved many lives lost to the Saddam regime's brutality.
That said, there was no UN mandate to invade in either case, so the legelity of the war has always been dubious.
I wish politicians read a bit of history, however, including President Obama; because if they did they would think far more carefully about intentions in Afghanistan, as well as Iraq.
It remains vital that we all support the work of our armed forces in both places: I know only too well how important it is to those risking their lives. And how questions are asked during the return of body bags and assembling for funerals. Somehow we have to separate our concerns about political decision from our support for the people risking their lives on our behalf. That is a tough call, but an important one.
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